Comments on: Some Basic Global Warming Questions and Answers http://www.danielbbotkin.com/2009/04/11/some-basic-global-warming-questions-and-answers/ Reflections of a renegade naturalist Tue, 15 Jun 2010 21:12:29 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Dan http://www.danielbbotkin.com/2009/04/11/some-basic-global-warming-questions-and-answers/comment-page-1/#comment-4810 Dan Tue, 14 Apr 2009 19:05:26 +0000 http://www.danielbbotkin.com/?p=190#comment-4810 I welcome discussion of these 21 points. Of particular interest is L. Carey's statement that at least "some of us are less worried about how the polar bears will fare, and a lot more worried about the ability of HUMAN SOCIETIES to adapt to rapid climate changes." I am glad to read this, as I think it is a correct concern, and that this is where we should be placing much more emphasis in the discussion of climate change. About <strong>mountain glaciers</strong>: Of course it is accurate to say that what is happening on Mt. Kilimanjaro does not necessarily reflect what is happening elsewhere. And there lies the key warning. Mt. Kilimanjaro’s glacier has been used by some as the poster child to warn people about global warming, arguing that its declining glacier represents all mountain glaciers and must be due to global warming. The reality of nature is rarely so simple. We live in a time where we wish for simple answers, and are, as a result, often handed slogan and photographs as if these represented to whole truth. Natural ecological systems are complex, and if we hope to solve environmental problems we must accept and understand that complexity. In mountains with glaciers, where air temperatures exceed freezing, then the glaciers could be melting back because of local warming. The scientific article that explains why Mt. Kilimanjaro’s glacier has been receding for a long time explains how scientists can tell the difference between temperature-caused glacier melt-back and other causes. I welcome discussion of these 21 points. Of particular interest is L. Carey’s statement that at least “some of us are less worried about how the polar bears will fare, and a lot more worried about the ability of HUMAN SOCIETIES to adapt to rapid climate changes.” I am glad to read this, as I think it is a correct concern, and that this is where we should be placing much more emphasis in the discussion of climate change.

About mountain glaciers: Of course it is accurate to say that what is happening on Mt. Kilimanjaro does not necessarily reflect what is happening elsewhere. And there lies the key warning. Mt. Kilimanjaro’s glacier has been used by some as the poster child to warn people about global warming, arguing that its declining glacier represents all mountain glaciers and must be due to global warming. The reality of nature is rarely so simple. We live in a time where we wish for simple answers, and are, as a result, often handed slogan and photographs as if these represented to whole truth.

Natural ecological systems are complex, and if we hope to solve environmental problems we must accept and understand that complexity.

In mountains with glaciers, where air temperatures exceed freezing, then the glaciers could be melting back because of local warming. The scientific article that explains why Mt. Kilimanjaro’s glacier has been receding for a long time explains how scientists can tell the difference between temperature-caused glacier melt-back and other causes.

]]> By: L. Carey http://www.danielbbotkin.com/2009/04/11/some-basic-global-warming-questions-and-answers/comment-page-1/#comment-4803 L. Carey Tue, 14 Apr 2009 15:17:27 +0000 http://www.danielbbotkin.com/?p=190#comment-4803 Contra to the tenor of your assertions in #8 & 9 regarding "unproven" climate models as the basis for global warming predictions, it is more accurate to note that such predictions are based on (1) paleoclimate data, (2) real world observations (for example, contra to the inference in your #20, the observed high melting rates of a significant majority of mountain glaciers around the world, including those serving as a principal summer water source of densely populated regions), and (3) only then models, with the models being tested against (1) and (2). The tenor of your remarks in this regard are somewhat misleading. Also, some of us are less worried about how the polar bears will fare, and a lot more worried about the ability of HUMAN SOCIETIES to adapt to rapid climate changes (especially possible negative agricultural impacts, which could cause great disruption relatively quickly given the current lack of significant global surplus - e.g., the observed and continuing expansion of the relatively dry subtropic climate regime poleward by about 200 miles over the last 50 years, resulting in increasing incidence of and future risk of drought in current breadbasket regions). Regards. Contra to the tenor of your assertions in #8 & 9 regarding “unproven” climate models as the basis for global warming predictions, it is more accurate to note that such predictions are based on (1) paleoclimate data, (2) real world observations (for example, contra to the inference in your #20, the observed high melting rates of a significant majority of mountain glaciers around the world, including those serving as a principal summer water source of densely populated regions), and (3) only then models, with the models being tested against (1) and (2). The tenor of your remarks in this regard are somewhat misleading. Also, some of us are less worried about how the polar bears will fare, and a lot more worried about the ability of HUMAN SOCIETIES to adapt to rapid climate changes (especially possible negative agricultural impacts, which could cause great disruption relatively quickly given the current lack of significant global surplus – e.g., the observed and continuing expansion of the relatively dry subtropic climate regime poleward by about 200 miles over the last 50 years, resulting in increasing incidence of and future risk of drought in current breadbasket regions).
Regards.

]]> By: tom weschler http://www.danielbbotkin.com/2009/04/11/some-basic-global-warming-questions-and-answers/comment-page-1/#comment-4764 tom weschler Mon, 13 Apr 2009 14:06:44 +0000 http://www.danielbbotkin.com/?p=190#comment-4764 So glad you wrote this and that John Bockstoce sent it on to me. Will be passing it around to friends, Where is the public challenge to the new policies now being proposed? Not from you, who supplies the scientific info, but some columnist or reporter who realizes how public policy is being railroaded by pseudo-technology. Ought to be a national debate or outcry. Trying some, but not the contacts so far. Tom Weschler So glad you wrote this and that John Bockstoce sent it on to me. Will be passing it around to friends, Where is the public challenge to the new policies now being proposed? Not from you, who supplies the scientific info, but some columnist or reporter who realizes how public policy is being railroaded by pseudo-technology. Ought to be a national debate or outcry. Trying some, but not the contacts so far. Tom Weschler

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